Just started cutting, not doing so well, why?

[Redline]

Ok, so I got the Masahiro Kill Bill model and the White Shadow in brown instead of white. I bought a bunch of those beach mats. I don't have them firmly mounted and I'm trying horizontal cuts in my living room. The best I've done is to cut about 3/4 of the way through one. I'm not swinging as hard as I could cause I have a wall behind me that I don't want to hit. But based on the videos I've seen it doesn't look like you have to take a full batting swing to cut through something.

Does the fact that they are not firmly nounted have something to do with it? Basicly whenever I swing and hit the rolled up mat, it goes flying. When I pick it up off the floor it has a cut 3/4 of the way through.

What about the beach mats vs the tatami ones? I notice that those tatami ones in the videos look softer and heavier. The extra weight might make them stay put instead of flying off the mount when you hit them. Thus the sword gets to slice through them completely. Just a theory, what do you think?

[Firehand10k]

Did you first soak the mats? Tatami is cut wet and so should straw, paper rolls, or most others. It is the water that softens and weights the fibers. Actually when properly prepared tatami is harder than the beach mats. If you have soaked them then it comes down too blade sharpness and geometry and your cutting technique. Don't get frustrated. I made many plastic bottles fly before I found out they should be cut full to add weight/stability. Now I can cut them much better.

[Brian Brazier]

I would start with plastic bottles or milk jugs, stuff like that, they are allot easier to cut, and will be allot more forgiving to your sword, beach mats can and will bend your sword with a bad cut. As for your cutting technique that will take time, get a bokken (if you don't already have one), and practice. Obviously a trained professional is the best way to learn, but that isn't an option for everyone, if that is the case get a good book like one of these http://www.overstock.com/Books-Movies-Music-Games/Flashing-Steel/138322/product.html http://www.overstock.com/Books-Movies-Music-Games/The-Art-of-Japanese-Swordsmanship/129444/product.html http://www.overstock.com/Books-Movies-Music-Games/Bokken-Art-of-the-Japanese-Sword/801945/product.html and practice in front of a mirror

[Redline]

Thanks guys. I didn't soak the mats. Can you tell me how please? I suppose I put them in a tub of water but for how long? And do I let them partially dry afterwards or use them almost soaking wet?

[bobO]

Brian,we have to hook Redline up with THE mat guys in cali(Mugan Dachi?). Redline,If your cutting free standing DRY mats,you're doing great.You will notice a big diff once you soak them.You can do it in your tub,for 24 hrs ,rolled up.Or you can buy one of those plastic colthes thinges ,The kind you slide under the bed,which is where I found mine.Then let them (the mats)drain for 15 to 20 minutes before cutting.Make yourself a stand it will make the whole thing more enjoyable for you and less chance of you whacking your sword on something and breaking it.Good luck Be safe,have fun.Little advice,Make each cut like your life was in the balance.OH yeah;What Brian said!! To Roll them I take the bottom third fold that towards the middle,start rolling tight,take the last 10",fold it towards your roll finish rolling.Tie it off every 8" or so,that's how I do it.Don't use wire!

[Redline]

Thanks guys. I did order a stand on ebay. The wooden one with the wooden spike. I have one of those plastic clothes things too so I should be set there. I'll check out the links to the book also, thanks. By the way, do you guys have a preferance, beach or tatami? So far I know of 2 places where I can get tatami online, the Mugen Dachi place and a place called keen mirror. Any others?

[Brian Brazier]

as a preference I like Tatami, but they are too expensive for me to use them all the time, beach mats are great cause they are cheap, and will give you the proper feedback you need. Mugen Dachi http://www.tameshigiri.com/ has great mats, I buy 20 new mats once or twice a year, the rest of the time beach mats are my target of choice, they also sell used mats but they need to cleaned and inspected for foreign objects (rocks, dirt, staples, etc..) these will scratch and possibly damage your blade for good

[bobO]

My computer hates me.Sorry

[bobO]

Well,Tatami is the cutting medium of choice,but that can get pricey.You can buy thick mats right here at SOM or thin beach mats.Every thing else is fair game.But IMO you should stay away from rolled newspaper and heavy cardboard tubes and trees,just gives me the creeps.But hey it's your sword just be careful.If you really want to push the envelope you can put GREEN bamboo in the center of your mat.:)

[Redline]

Ok, I'll have to try some tatami. Meanwhile I have ordered about 20 of the beach ones in 2 separate orders, 4 of which are hacked already. So, no heavy carbboard tubes huh??? OOPS, too late. My Masahiro White Shadow came in a nice colorful (but very hard) cardboard tube. After not being able to cut through the dry beach mats, I sliced through the external brown shipping box like a hot knife through butter, so I figured I'd take on the tube. I got half way through with one sword and 3/4 through with the other.

By the way, I can see that sooner or later I am gonna need a sharpening kit. Both of the ones sold on SOM are not in stock. I probably need the one with the instructional dvd. Do you knaow where else I can buy a similar kit? Also, I only saw the beach mats on SOM. Do you have a link to the heavy ones? Never mind, I just found them. The bamboo ones for $7 right?

[bobO]

Yup,those are the ones.Got to tell you I'm loyal to Jason to a fault,what you want is out there,but if I was you I'd order one from Jason,cause he be da bomb.You should go over to SBG forum and check out the thread "9260 Broken"page 7, secound post from the end and check out that link,also what Paul Southern had to say.

[Redline]

By the way, I am now starting to realize that as deadly as these swords are, and even though some are forged differently and use harder steel, etc, etc, etc, they all have about the same limitations. They can all kill with one blow, which is what they were designed to do, wether they cost $75 or $3,000. All those videos I see with both expensive and inexpensive swords cutting through the same tatami shouldn't be so surprising. That's what they were designed to do.

But, As I read somewhere recently, they can't cut stone, steel, or heavy/thick wood. The more expensive ones might last longer and be tougher to break or dull, but I think it's fair to say that a $1,500 sword is not 10 x tougher or 10 x harder to break or dull than a $150 sword. It might be twice as hard and twice as tough to break or dull, but not 10 x. And on top of that they all require some maintanance (oil the blade, etc.).

What do you guys think?

[bobO]

I think your no dummy.The force runs strong in this one.

[Firehand10k]

With the more expensive swords you are paying for quality and craftsmanship. They may cut better depending on how well the cheap one was made. They should definitely look better, more finished. They may be tougher and they should be expected to have better quality controls. In most ways the more expensive one should be expected to last longer and look nicer but with luck there are cheap ones to be found that may perform about the same.

[Redline]

Hey bob0, you're not gonna believe this, but I wrote my last post above before I read your post that said to go to the 9260 broken link. I finished writing mine, I hit submit reply, then I saw your post. It looks to me like I am starting to understand these swords. I used to think the better ones were indestructible. LOL. Thanks.

[Yaso]

When I got my first decent sword (The PPKE), I ran out to wal-mart, and bought a few anti-weed mats for roughly $3.00 a pop. It was basically a thick black cloth wrapped around a cardboard tube. The whole thing was roughly 6" in diameter, and after soaking them in a swimming pool and mounting them on an outdoor chair, they made for excelent cutting targets.

Fun times.

[tclause]

try pool noodles until you get a reasonable technique down so that you do not damage your sword or yourself. noodles are very cheap and large 6' or so. lots of cuts per noodle. leave the sharpening to the pros there are other post reference this you will ruin the geometry of the blade.

[RobbyDoom]

This thread is great for anyone starting to cut.
Thanks.

I'm just wondering if I'm the only one that caught the part about the livingroom.

[Brian Brazier]

I don't know how I missed that, wow, not so smart, hopefully by now he has moved his operation outside

[RobbyDoom]

I don't know how I missed that, wow, not so smart, hopefully by now he has moved his operation outside

Indeed, I could never try that in the livingroom, I would perform seppuku if anything happened to my Flat Panel TV!!!!! :cry: